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Post by Swampfox on Dec 8, 2020 21:08:17 GMT
Required; ALWAYS EXIT TO WAITING ROOM UPON BEING FLAMED, and
INSTALL ACE'S FLAME PROTECTION/START GAME PROGRAM INTO YOUR PRIMARY FOLDER - But always exit when flamed. Ace's program is backup insurance to prevent boots.
FAILING TO EXIT OR USE ACE'S PROGRAM RESULTS IN MAJOR OR BOOTING OF ALL PILOTS FROM THE GAME!!
Ace's program appears to not work when you are flying a Linux-based Operating System (check for updates from Ace!)
Please see my latest post on this in Ace's program thread....
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No politics - it's hard to shoot straight when you're mad
Rockets, bombs and machinegun supression bombing on runways, and air-to-air rocketing and bombing encouraged. These practices were not allowed previouly, which were called "vulching".
No ditching and re-life-ing
Always fill in short side; Preferably, someone change sides if your side is up 2 pilots
Question: should we allow bombing of the solo "first" target on the first round regardless of the number of pilots present? We are currently enjoying a steady roster of higher numbers. Allowing for bombing the solo target hopefully encourages everyone to get into the server closer to the starting time?
Post your rules in a new post below: it will be added to this list for review and discussion
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Post by hans on Dec 27, 2020 20:13:28 GMT
This brings up a good point. I have noticed let's say there are only four players and your at a target. One plane can have a hard time being effective and then after the turn change, you try again. The target is brand new again and you have to start over. I'm not sure this is the best thing under all circumstances and wonder if that can be changed if we wanted to try it the other way with cumulative damage.
Also I am very new yet and get my views crossed up or judge the closeness to the ground wrong etc. So it may seem like I'm ditching the plane and getting another one, but rather just poor pilot skills and in some cases good ol WinXP will forget the joystick calibration and no control is possible.
I always go to the side that needs a pilot and then try to be as good to the team as I can. If I'm at a target and the Ace protecting it has me about beat, I'll try to unload the ordinance if I can on the target to maybe help a teammate who may be on the way to try and take it down.
I've also tried to land at times and the plane doesn't get fixed and I get no more ammo, so I have found it best to simply re-up when damaged and out of ammo and whoever was shooting at me does get the kill even if I accidentally crash or re-start. Even the solo computer driven version seems to act this way.
I think the best thing is and I haven't had a problem so far, is not shooting someone taking off and I won't do that. Let the player get up in the air so they can play the game. When on dial up years ago, I tried online and never got off the ground. That did make me mad so I took off from another air field and figured out how to go back to where I was. Well no limit on ammo and such so I bombed them continuously from 20,000 feet and they didn't like that much. Never played online again because there was no way to play, just waste an hour getting blown up at the air field.
I bet there are others out there like me and if they were to come across the awesome community that is here today, they would like to come and get a chance to play and have fun too.
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Post by raf56bowman on Dec 28, 2020 14:01:11 GMT
Hans,
The issue of whether or not to have the targets repair after each change has been discussed previously....look back through some of the earlier threads, you'll find the discussions. Briefly, some like the way it is (targets repair), and others think as you do that they should not repair. Right now, the server is set for targets to repair.
I'm also using WinXP, but have not experienced the calibration problem you speak of. What joystick do you use?
I've also wondered what is the best course of action when out of ammo and bombs. There's really not much you can do except perhaps lead an enemy away from other teammates who are bombing, or just renew as you say...give the last guy who shot you the kill.
Shooting someone while they are trying to take off is called vulching. (Stealing someone's kill after they fought hard for it is (or was) also called vulching, if memory serves). Either kind of vulching is very frowned on, at least in the Team Melee servers like War & 4. (Occasional vulching was more common and accepted in the free-for-all Melee servers, which I haven't seen in awhile, and not sure we'll ever see again). I am sorry you experienced what you did. I saw that once when I made the mistake of entering a server run by a particular squadron....they just kept hammering me on the ground. (If they wanted it for themselves it should have been passworded). It's a form of bullying and should have no place in this game. An excellent way to discourage new players. I hope that behavior is in the past. I will add that you will most likely never see that in the War & 4 server.
Cavu
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Post by raf56bowman on Dec 28, 2020 14:34:56 GMT
Another suggested rule:
NO INTENTIONAL VULCHING (shooting someone on the ground, or intentionally stealing a kill. Anyone remember Sourkraut?)
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Post by halibut on Dec 28, 2020 20:24:21 GMT
"Anyone remember Sourkraut?"....yes loved him He gave great colour to the game, and irritated those sanctimonious, anal squadies that ultimately destroyed the game with their tribal biases...dont get me started on "the good old days" I loved winging with him when the squadies used to try and gang up on him...great fun ...not that he would ever make me feel welcome, he always kept up the persona he choose right till the end. Suppressing someone on the ground in this new environment is a valid part of the game. And kill stealing is very rare...usually accidental due to over exuberance. As someone who played through all eras of RB, The behavior in this game we play now has never been better.
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Post by raf56bowman on Dec 28, 2020 22:36:15 GMT
Hans,
Regarding your WinXP problem - I had a similar problem years ago. My joystick would keep going out of calibration - RB3D, MS Flight Sim, whatever. I had to keep going into settings and recalibrate it. Found out the cause was the PC's power supply was going bad, when it died completely. When I replaced the power supply, no more calibration problems. Could this be your problem?
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Post by Swampfox on Dec 30, 2020 20:59:06 GMT
<sigh> again, agree a lot with the Hal. Suppression doesn't come across in this format as unfair, and you can do it to the enemy. It isn't used very much and something usually happens to break it up fairly quickly.
Out of ammo?? Including ROCKETS? been a little lucky lately with those... sure is a pretty thing to see wings blowing off!
IMHO...leaving when you can still fly...even if "empty", messes with the overall realism...even if someone gets a kill score. Sometimes...no, often, some pilots will not kill an enemy when they have failed to kill their target by turnover..and they are forced to fly home..and your wingmen have one less enemy spawn on them at target drome that could still be huffing home wayyyy over yonder. It is hard for many to let those go...
Hans, your skills are growing every week.
The "new [relaxed] rules" seem to add to the game rather than degrading it. If we are fortunate enough to see some new pilots, providing they are not vets, individually you might hold back on some advantage gained over a "newb" (once)...just don't expect Zilski to have any mercy. Doing that could cost you the war..however.
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Post by halibut on Dec 31, 2020 4:40:03 GMT
[<sigh> again, agree a lot with the Hal.] .... its like the coronavirus, most get well [IMHO...leaving when you can still fly...even if "empty", messes with the overall realism]... Agree, but you rarely have to fly all the way home. its like a kitten wandering through a pack of rottweilers,someone usually puts you out of your misery. [Suppression doesn't come across in this format as unfair, and you can do it to the enemy. It isn't used very much and something usually happens to break it up fairly quickly.] ....Yes,i specialize in it to keep them away from targets, but i cant remember when there was ever less than two to deal with, so if i could last a minute i was lucky, till it was halibut fry up time.
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Voss
Members
Posts: 16
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da Rules
Jan 8, 2021 11:37:27 GMT
via mobile
Post by Voss on Jan 8, 2021 11:37:27 GMT
Good ol Sourkraut..... Kinda miss that dude lol
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Post by hans on Jan 12, 2021 15:05:39 GMT
Thank you all for the awesome feedback. I diagnosed the Dell 6400, bad main battery and bad CMOS battery. They are quirky machines at times. My son has the same machine he's not using and lent me his battery. Much better behavior and the supplies are actually pretty new and larger than stock. I even have a 140 watt from an older Dell.
Joysticks are relatively new, a pair of Logitech force feedbacks and one 3dPro. I will definitely try not to crash so much, I seem to be trying something, mess up my view and then kiss the ground. It's ok whatever the group wishes on target reset since both can be an advantage. However if I'm doing something wrong, just let me know and I will try and correct it. It's just awesome to be able to fly with you all.
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Post by Swampfox on Jan 31, 2021 16:40:03 GMT
EXIT RULE: I was asked why we need to exit after being killed instead of re-lifing. I didn't know anyone didn't know the science. Quick summary, 15 years ago some of us ran a test wherein we would bomb a target taking out +50% and -50%, then exiting rather than returning to base, and allowing the plane to rearm. 100% of the time, the rule, which came to be called the 50% rule, would harden the target. This was a bastardization of an intention function designed to prevent cheating, but was ever made known so the target hardening became a mystery. So, if someone thinks its ok just to relife after bring killed, it causes the same issue depending on the level of damage imposed during bombing, which becomes more variable with a drome because there are so many elements which can be destroyed.
So, we all practice exiting the game upon being killed. If you were not aware of this, please..please, practice this established rule for the integrity of the game.
S!
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Post by Swampfox on Jan 31, 2021 17:04:44 GMT
Bombing, Rocketing, ground strafing....legitimate use of force in RB3D?
I did use all of the above to suppress Cavu on his "tarmac" at D3. As long as it was one plane, one can use that practice for quite awhile if you avoid AA ..AAA almost always gets some hits in.
I upset Cavu, and realized it when I got a direct hit with a bomb on his plane.
The sound of a bomb or a rocket hitting a plane is really exciting as you can hear the wood cracking and skins ripping...and in some cases, hear the engine make a sort of bang sound. Correct me if I am wrong, but Hal, Zilski, Fo Paws....and a few others use all arming assets whenever and wherever possible. Additionally, when one is successful at their use, especially with rockets or bombs, it typically generates a lot of laughing, saluting...fun regardless of which end one is on....it is a bit of a unicorn moment in RB and is sort of celebrated....
but Cavu was not happy...and I completely understand... I thought it must be because he had not experienced it before..either way...and it seems maybe unfair or illegal because in the 2nd decade of RB3D is was generally illegal..unless it was the famous "no rules" server. We have, when the subject has come up, not really had anyone say they want it to be illegal and comments have pretty much always been...."its OK..and fun". It is not easy to bomb or rocket another plane...(did hit someone with a bomb air to air one time!!).
So, to Cavu I apologize for the discomfort I caused. Using those weapons is not intended to make someone feel badly.
Regards
Swampfox
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Post by raf56bowman on Jan 31, 2021 21:19:42 GMT
Well Swamp, the Guilt Fairy must have visited you later because I don't recall saying or doing anything that indicated I was upset. I WAS a little peeved though, but I recalled the earlier discussion about this (see the Dec 28 posts above on this same thread), and I just figured that it's ok in this server - plus, I considered the possibility that I could do the same to you if the opportunity came up (which it didn't). I am trying to sort out my decaying memories on this - as I mentioned above, what you were doing was vulching, which was very frowned upon and considered unsportsmanlike about the time I left mmp for several years. Only the jerks did it - that is what I recall. It also could be that I am confusing the free-for-all melee servers with the team melees, which generally had different rules. All this could have changed during the time I was off mmp. It may be necessary to hammer out a decision on this though, so that all have the same understanding, and to avoid hard feelings.
Cavu
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Post by halibut on Jan 31, 2021 22:11:41 GMT
"Bombing, Rocketing, ground strafing....legitimate use of force in RB3D?" Yes that is the new dictum now in our modern game, has been for a number of years...and rightly so. It came to fruition in devilles servers, a man of common sense. They had all those Honor" rules in the old days for power play purposes. Another one trotted out in the "good old days" was not shooting someone out of ammo....pffft.
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Post by Swampfox on Feb 1, 2021 7:40:24 GMT
EXIT RULE: I was asked why we need to exit after being killed instead of re-lifing. I didn't know anyone didn't know the science. Quick summary, 15 years ago some of us ran a test wherein we would bomb a target taking out +50% and -50%, then exiting rather than returning to base, and allowing the plane to rearm. 100% of the time, the rule, which came to be called the 50% rule, would harden the target. This was a bastardization of an intention function designed to prevent cheating, but was ever made known so the target hardening became a mystery. So, if someone thinks its ok just to relife after bring killed, it causes the same issue depending on the level of damage imposed during bombing, which becomes more variable with a drome because there are so many elements which can be destroyed. So, we all practice exiting the game upon being killed. If you were not aware of this, please..please, practice this established rule for the integrity of the game. S! To clarify, the hardening ONLY occurs once you return to that 50% target and attack it....I don't think it required dropping some element (for example, normally, you realize that a blackened hangar is almost, if not as good as a flattened one once you have either blackened or flattened a hangar...and once the final hangar is hit...assuming that everyone attacking that target exited upon death, the target falls). But that is how the hardening occurs...either hitting or dropping it with a bomb, maybe a rocket and the same with bullets. Another aspect of target destruction, again with aerodromes as an example (the following is true of any target)...there IS an ALGORITHM for targets which can act quite mysteriously...very much so in certain cases but is not predictable. The most extreme surprise for me was when I was practicing bombing; when I dropped my bomb...only bomb....the entire drome fell. It had been untouched and no one else was in the server. I wrote, then called Cameljock. The drome had fallen, but the record does not detail out damage data. I had targeted a specific area on a hangar known to be a "sweet spot"...and it really was. You can observe such surprising results with really focused bombing, but an entire drome falling with one bomb is an anomaly. I have seen building dumps fall with two bombs fairly frequently, but again, with very careful targeting...ahem...targeting the bottom of a wall as low as possible, as close to the corner as possible. That was precisely what I was doing when the whole drome fell...with a single bomb. It was stunning. FYI FOLLOWUP note: the single bomb event was not in one of the arcade servers like the AV squad used. Their serverOp would set the server at a low level so it would always take a small number of bombs to take it down. S!
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